Posts by Utopian Reformist

34

Recent JW EXPEDITIONS TO MOUNT ARARAT

by Utopian Reformist in

jw
friends

despite the apparent redundancy, i would like to introduce the subject from a different perspective.

around 1996 i came in contact with a jw pioneer named "francesco annunziata" from naples, italy.. francesco was involved with a man (inactive jw) named angelo palego, with whom he has made several expeditions to mt.

ararat searching the famous ahora gorge for remnants of the ark.. the majority of the more technical and geological/scientific information is in italian, but there is enough information posted in english to merit attention.. i posted this subject in an effort to move away from discussing the flood, size of the flood and/or location of the flood.

Utopian Reformist

Hey MOX:

Long time no discuss. Listen, I have NEVER heard anything about Palego doctoring anything. If that is true, send me the reference. Like I said in the beginning, I am planning to contact these guys again and would like to know the real scoop and have a reference ready, if necessary.

My sister (still lives in Italy) told me that they made major headlines and were the scientific "rave" for awhile. I would like to have the most recent informaiton and facts. I will check and do a follow-up. Please post your reference in the meantime, I would appreciate it. Thx Mox!

34

Recent JW EXPEDITIONS TO MOUNT ARARAT

by Utopian Reformist in

jw
friends

despite the apparent redundancy, i would like to introduce the subject from a different perspective.

around 1996 i came in contact with a jw pioneer named "francesco annunziata" from naples, italy.. francesco was involved with a man (inactive jw) named angelo palego, with whom he has made several expeditions to mt.

ararat searching the famous ahora gorge for remnants of the ark.. the majority of the more technical and geological/scientific information is in italian, but there is enough information posted in english to merit attention.. i posted this subject in an effort to move away from discussing the flood, size of the flood and/or location of the flood.

Utopian Reformist

Eddie:

You said:

"Uto, even I can tell thats a touched up photo...lol"

eddie
************************
Have you visited the site to examine the different angles and approaches used in the photography? Are you familiar with photographic techniques? Are you an expert in imaging?

How powerful, discreet and exact is your vision? Do your eyes have the ability to seprate pixels in a computer image? Believe me Eddie, I am very skeptical too. But I know these guys. Their JW status is NOT a factor, nor the primary issue. As a matter of fact, back in 1997, Francesco and I had a month long argument about the value of finding anything on Ararat.

I argued that if the bible was true, and Jesus walked the earth and the world is still confused about religion, what good would finding the Ark do, other than start controversy, invite skepticism? I advised him to use whatever he found to jump start his archaeological/scientific career and forget about the vindication of Jehovah's name thing. I told him at the very least he might make some money.

That's my two cents. But, at least I made a thorough examination and I can vouch for both fellows.

41

The Improbability of God

by gravedancer in

irishmen blow each other up in his name.

arabs blow themselves up in his name.

imams and ayatollahs oppress women in his name.

Utopian Reformist

The answer is quite simple and very brief. Why do people believe in a supreme being?

FEAR OF DEATH and FEAR OF THE UNKNOWN and SUPERSTITION

34

Recent JW EXPEDITIONS TO MOUNT ARARAT

by Utopian Reformist in

jw
friends

despite the apparent redundancy, i would like to introduce the subject from a different perspective.

around 1996 i came in contact with a jw pioneer named "francesco annunziata" from naples, italy.. francesco was involved with a man (inactive jw) named angelo palego, with whom he has made several expeditions to mt.

ararat searching the famous ahora gorge for remnants of the ark.. the majority of the more technical and geological/scientific information is in italian, but there is enough information posted in english to merit attention.. i posted this subject in an effort to move away from discussing the flood, size of the flood and/or location of the flood.

Utopian Reformist

Sorry, here is a much better picture for those of you who are still interested in this subject:
**********************************

34

Recent JW EXPEDITIONS TO MOUNT ARARAT

by Utopian Reformist in

jw
friends

despite the apparent redundancy, i would like to introduce the subject from a different perspective.

around 1996 i came in contact with a jw pioneer named "francesco annunziata" from naples, italy.. francesco was involved with a man (inactive jw) named angelo palego, with whom he has made several expeditions to mt.

ararat searching the famous ahora gorge for remnants of the ark.. the majority of the more technical and geological/scientific information is in italian, but there is enough information posted in english to merit attention.. i posted this subject in an effort to move away from discussing the flood, size of the flood and/or location of the flood.

Utopian Reformist

Here is a sample photo from the Rezzonico Expedition:

********************
"This photo was shot in August 24 - 1993 by the Palego -Rezzonico expedition, while they were prisoners of Kurd guerillas at 3500 m level 27 days, near Kop Lake, just in front of "Parrot Glacier". It shows piece D broken into two pieces."
********************

34

Recent JW EXPEDITIONS TO MOUNT ARARAT

by Utopian Reformist in

jw
friends

despite the apparent redundancy, i would like to introduce the subject from a different perspective.

around 1996 i came in contact with a jw pioneer named "francesco annunziata" from naples, italy.. francesco was involved with a man (inactive jw) named angelo palego, with whom he has made several expeditions to mt.

ararat searching the famous ahora gorge for remnants of the ark.. the majority of the more technical and geological/scientific information is in italian, but there is enough information posted in english to merit attention.. i posted this subject in an effort to move away from discussing the flood, size of the flood and/or location of the flood.

Utopian Reformist

Greetings All:

Despite the apparent redundancy, I would like to introduce the subject from a different perspective. Around 1996 I came in contact with a JW pioneer named "Francesco Annunziata" from Naples, Italy.

Francesco was involved with a man (inactive JW) named Angelo Palego, with whom he has made several expeditions to Mt. Ararat searching the famous Ahora Gorge for remnants of the Ark.

The majority of the more technical and geological/scientific information is in italian, but there is enough information posted in english to merit attention.

I posted this subject in an effort to move away from discussing the flood, size of the flood and/or location of the flood. Since water-borne disasters do occur naturally on this planet, I thought it was redundant to continue expanding that theme. Here is something fresher:

http://www.r-j.it/noahark/frame_main.htm

I haven't spoken with Francesco since 1999, and I will re-establish communication with him ASAP for updates and comments. Enjoy!

51

NY Telecom & Wonder Woman 77

by Utopian Reformist in

jw
friends

while it may be "politically correct" to jump all over nytelecom, let's face it, how many of you actually laughed at his post, before recomposing yourself and deciding to "grab a rope" and join the lynch mob?

i wonder who will be honest.

i am not a fan of nytelecom or fredhall or madapostate.

Utopian Reformist

Lisa:

You're right. WW77 has NEVER made such jokes or authorized anyone to engage in that type of humor. I know that.

By mentioning some popular examples of celebrities who unofficially gave license for such humor, I was hoping to solidify my point of not taking things so seriously and that we are all different and flawed, and not to succumb to personal, self-effacing scrutiny, because of external criticism.

Yes I did laugh. I also know that alot of other people did too! I just had the gumption to try to make a learning experience out of it, rather than just let simple male immaturity go to waste.

Perhaps you are stronger than I am. Perhaps the sub-conscious "triggers" that activate humor in me are many and frivolous, immature and childish like NYT. I don't think it's frequent, or permanent however.

I don't know WW77 on a personal basis. I applaude you for defending her rights and for displaying your solidarity. If I were WW77 I would thank you.

Now, I am sorry my weakness overcame me, but that is all I can offer to WW77. I have hidden my nose from view, grown extra long hair, worn hats, worn glasses all in an effort to avoid the same occasional, spontaneous immaturity. It didn't work, nor make it less painfull.

I don't know what the most correct answer is, I only know a few methods for living through the moment and moving forward.

Lisa, I always appreciate and respect your comments and thx alot!

75

Giving Up Smoking

by ballistic in

jw
friends

i'm giving up smoking on the 22nd.

it will be the third time, but this time as part of a government sponsored training course with drugs and patches supplied etc.

anyone else given up and got any helpfull advise?.

Utopian Reformist

Three million cheers and a giant hurrah for Ballistic!

75

Giving Up Smoking

by ballistic in

jw
friends

i'm giving up smoking on the 22nd.

it will be the third time, but this time as part of a government sponsored training course with drugs and patches supplied etc.

anyone else given up and got any helpfull advise?.

Utopian Reformist

However you accomplish your goal, I am proud of you and wish you complete and permanent success!

Keep the money and spend it well and enjoy many more years of health and just like the WTBS, give the tobacco companies what they really deserve!

15

Where is the Truth???????

by BC in

jw
friends

i studied with the jws for a number of years and i found that on your doorstep they were the friendliest people in the world, but the firsrt time i stepped into the kh, with the exception of a few they didn't want to know!!!!!!!!!

i sat on a chair alone for the whole of most meetings, sometimes i even had a whole row to myself.. i then began to realise that i was only a statistic on a monthly report card.

in other words if someone was pioneering or it was raining they only had to come and see me to make their hours up.. question the blood issue and they will walk past your house with their heads down and push your magazines through the letter box when they know you are out to avoid seeing you.. i love my family, but according to the jws my lovely husband, my children and my grandaughter who i love more than life itself have no chance in the new system.

Utopian Reformist

Some of you are going to get angry with me for writing this, but, I have no other choice.

One of the reasons it took so long for me to see the WTBS clearly, is my regular (and secret) search through "apostate" literature was not satisfying. I had read literally hundreds of accounts of people who felt just like the post that began this thread.

These personal stories related how they felt alone, abandoned, uncared for, unwanted, left out, unaccepted, once they began associating regularly. Depsite all of the rosy promises in the WTBS literature, there were also hundreds of talks and sermons urging people not to focus on social issues, but KEEP BUSY, MAKE PROGRESS, BUY OUT OPPORTUNE TIME, DON'T COMPLAIN.

Remember all of those uncomfortable and insensitive reminders? I do. The JW's are not selling a social club atmosphere. Sure they are super friendly in the beginning, then right after baptism you're on your won. You're expected to get right in there and start working.

When I read similar accounts about lack of love, I just couldn't find sympathy/empathy in EVERY situation. I believe you MUST take FULL ownership of your life, whether religious or not.

Lack of company and friendship does prove or disprove the validity of any religious teaching, other than humans are a royal pain in the ***.

The teachings are a major problem and that is the impetus for freedom, not the lack of companionship. Why not ask the members of those congregations how they felt about the individual complaining?

In my personal case, in every hall I attended I was disliked, period. I enjoyed the silent tension and secret animosity. It kept all of my business private and kept people at bay. All they could do was gossip behind my back. Manage your outcomes in life and stop measuring what is good or bad based on people's flaws.